Hey Mike,

Glad to see you are still at it. I admire your persistance and courage in taking on all these changes. Car is looking good, keep us posted !

Rob.

Is that the right website? I saw a bunch of buildings. :confused: I'll do a search after I get home later tonight.

Thanks Rob, It's been a long, long road but there is an end in sight. I just have to work harder. :D

Oops! Sorry Mikey :o . Its: www.hokpaint.com :o

I'm nowhere close to being an expert on paint and bodywork, but I now know far more than I ever wanted to about the craft. :rolleyes: Wrenchnride has the right idea. When you apply your filler directly to bare metal you will get the best adhesion. On my car, I rubbed the spots to be filled real good with 80 grit to give the filler a good hook into the surface.

For primer, you can use Urethane based 2K primer, or Epoxy primer. 2K primer is good high build material. Most can be applied to bare metal, builds up good to give you some sanding room, and dries flat with no orange peel to sand out. Epoxy primer can seal out moisture, most will apply to bare metal, and can be bondoed over if needed. A friend in the biz recomended http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/ for their epoxy primer. He said it is user-friendly for DIY projects, and high quality for professionals. They're semi-local too, so you'll be supporting Georgia's private commerce sector :laugh: .

If your car's got a lot of small low spots to fill, or metal/filler spots to be blended you can use Dave's favorite primer, Evercoat Slicksand which will build extremely high, and dry hard. I found out it's often used to repair hail damage, and door dings. I used it on about 80% of mine to make sure I filled all the small creases and dings, and to blend the welded repairs I did. It works great in place of blending putty, but dried with an orange peel that needed some dry sanding.

Just don't use a self etching primer. Anything polyester based (most fillers, some surface primers) won't stick to it. The stuff I used dried very slow for some reason, and was a pain to remove from the areas that needed filler. Actually, by removing it from places that needed filler really works against the purpose for using it in the first place, which is to seal the bare metal.

By no means do I want to start an argument, but the idea is to share our experiences/thoughts right? With that being said....

I personally would not put filler directly on bare steel. Filler is pourus(sp?) and can actually absorb moisture, which would be undetectable to the eye, causing rust later in the car's life. Personal experience we used an Etch primer on CLEAN, Oil free metal(even natural skin oil, like when you touch the metal with your bare hands) to eat into the metal. After that we used a good quality Epoxy primer. The above two layers were put on as 'wash coats'(ie. VERY thin coats). The car was left for a few days to 'cure', to make sure ALL sovents evaporated etc. After that we used filler. I have seen cars come back with paintjobs not older than 4 months were filler started to lift, and upon closer inspection, I found that no Etch primer or Primer was used.

Then again, this was my personal experience/s... ;)

Zero, sharing is what these forum's are for ;) . I'm sure there are some companys that may say apply there filler over primer, but Evercoat does not (unless its just glazing putting). If your bare metal is prepped correctly 36-80 grit sand scrathes, pre cleaner used, then a quality filler applied, sand, epoxy prime, sand, primer sealer, base coat, (mid coat for some jobs) and then clear coat. There should be no moisture, and no filler coming off depending on how thick the filler is (too thick and any filler will come off). It sounds like some prep was missed on the jobs you saw this happening on (that's 90% of paint failures, plus incompatable materials from different companies)

I use House Of Kolor paint products (15 years now) and Evercoat products (6 years). Both companies recommend applying filler to bare metal. I've used PPG, Diamont, and BASF products for a few job's as well. Across the pond there are different laws that require different proccedures... such as using water based products as much as possible (except clear coats)

Personally, why would I want to change the way Jon Kosmoski (founder-painter) of House Of Kolor explains how He's done it for 50 years in several book's He's published about Paint and body work :D .

I'm not arguing... just stating facts ;)

I was actually told the same thing...The guy that painted my Triumph said he recomends laying down epoxy primer first,..then using filler.

Polyester can bond to epoxy primer better than bare metal, and WAAAAY better than it can bond to etch primer. The metal will always be sealed from moisture by the etch primer, and epoxy.

I didn't know this 'till I was finishing out my filler work on bare metal with the rest of the car covered in etch primer. Had I known filler would stick to epoxy, I would have gone from treated bare metal, to etch primer, to epoxy primer, to filler, to final coat of primer, to wet sand, to paint. Instead, I just left the epoxy primer out of the formula, and applied filler to bare metal treated with wax and grease remover.

My rear fenders were very bumpy. So it was hard to sand all of it, I'd just get the high spots. So I took a wire wheel on a angle grinder. The rest of the fender I used 80.

I started skiming it tonight. I'm really likeing the way it looks. I went to bare metal. I used something called Final Klean, I think that's what it's called. To wipe it down before I applied the filler. The guy I work for has painted cars before, I have his help. I just wanted a second opinion per-say.

We epoxyed our '47 but when we sanded looking for low and high spots we sanded through a lot of it, even though some stayed. :rolleyes:

wrenchnride247,

Thanks for the input. Sure, the forums are for sharing, it is just a precaution I do (most of the time) to try not to sound like a wise@$$ :laugh:

I understand that those guys have done it for like 50 years without problems. And if didnt work, they will not be where they are today... Maybe they have got some kind of rust preventative additive in their fillers that aids in anit-rust, that is all that I can think of. Or maybe over here, we dont realy have such good products :confused:

Its all good zero :agree: . But wise@$$ is one of the many services I provide :laugh: :laugh:

haha, I want a shirt that says. "Sarcasm, another one of the many services I offer" :laugh: Or something similar.

I guess it's okay to put filler over high build. Better be, cause I did it. Oh well, the rear fenders are looking good so far. I realized something, I have 1 really nice fender on the front and 1 really nice fender on the rear, they are my second attempt. The first of the front and rear both don't look as good as their mate. :rolleyes: They're passable, just not as good as my second try. What's worse, they're not on the same side

A good point I noticed, I think good, the car can be divided up in three major sections. To be finished 1 section at a time if need be. The rear clip, roof, and front clip. I can't forget the interior too.

The car as I see it, the fenders will be the most time consuming, the top is a strip, check for level and paint, the rest is a little of both. A few dings here and there, but over all the fenders are the most. Both doors are finished, along with the front hood, the rear hood will be strip to bare metal, hammer and dolly a lot, then probably skim for level ect. The deck lid looks horrible up close. :laugh:

Another day tomarrow, I'll be working til 5pm tomarrow and wednesday. Then all day thursday, friday, saturday, and maybe some sunday. I don't have any plans.

Thanks for the help guys.

Keep at it Mikey.
Thanks for the update - that is a big project you are doing!!!!!

Hello every body!!! I've been one busy beaver lately. I started at a Fab shop working 10hr shifts plus hanging at Tim's at night. I've been trying to work on my Ghia on weekends. I lost my cable to connect the camera to the computer, so I havn't posted any pictures. Until now... :cool:
Long over due shots, I'm way past this point. I'll need to update soon.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...3.jpg~original

Just a few more...

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...4.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...6.jpg~original

Here are the REALLY NICE seats Dave hooked me up with.

Here they are on the ride home.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...4.jpg~original
Here they are in the car, I LOVE them!
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...3.jpg~original

More pictures...

From the front. Don't they look soo good? Well, they could if you could see them.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...5.jpg~original

Since I'm on a picture posting rampage. Here are the new seats I put in my daily driver. They're out of a early 90's ford or something. They were free, so I can't complain.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
They are a nice ride.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...3.jpg~original

I'm going to have to catch the thread up with all the work I've done to the front fenders and the fire wall between the radiator and trunk area.

More pictures later.

Those rear fenders really turned out nice. They're subtle, not all bubbled out GT2 style.

Will it be a race between you, me, and Wiebrand to see who can get their GL together first? :laugh:

Glad you like the seats Mikey. Look at the wires and make sure I didn't mess up and get you heated seats. That would suck:laugh:

Mike,
Great to see the update.
You seem to have made a lot of progress...Those seats look very cool
I am looking forward to seeing the next set of pictures.

Great to see an update Mikey! :) Nice body work...

The body work is outstanding. :agree: :agree:

Hey Mike,

Looking good man ! What seats are those btw ?

Rob.

Yeti, Thanks. I've put a lot of work into the fenders. I know they're not perfect at all, but I've tried my best, and they please me so far. The fronts are about as close as the rears, maybe closer. I'm sure you and Wiebrand are a lot more detailed than me. I would love to be more detailed, but I don't have the time or the money to get caught up on the very minor details. All I want is a really nice show/driver.

No_H2O, I love the seats. I wouldn't mind heated seats, but I'll be alright with out them. I don't believe they're heated though.

Yellow73, now that I can copy pictures, I'll be updating more. I'm a few weeks behind on my updates. The seats are really comfy.

Oasis and Wrench, you two are too kind. I'm just trying my best. I know it won't be perfect. Like so perfect I can't even find a flaw.

Rob, Thanks. I believe they're out of a '04 Acura RSX. We can thank our club seat collector (No_h20) for those.

No_H2O called me last night, I told him I would have been happy with celica seats, but I'm glad they're not. That would look funny all of us having celica seats. :laugh:

Some very long over due updates and pictures.

Updates, Lanner finished my front brakes. They're in the mail. I bought a set of fiberglass bumpers.

My new fiber glass bumpers. The hood is about the color I want for my Ghia. It's not the hood for the car, just a donor that I havn't cut up yet. It's a nice color, I'm just not happy with it.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...7.jpg~original
This fender is VERY close.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...8.jpg~original
This fender is the closer of the two rear.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...9.jpg~original
A shot in profile, the body line on the top is good but not great. I'm trying to work on it.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...0.jpg~original

It's hard to see the grill with the bumper on the car.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
Another shot of the bumper cover up. :cool:
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original

It looks to be shaping up to a nice water cooled sleeper. I still need to do more work on it, but with 1 fender down and the roof very close. It's coming along. :D

Comments?

It's coming together nice Mikey. How long before you squirt some color on it?

I think it looks great. I can't wait to see it painted ... and road tested. :)

Man, thats looking real nice!! Keep on it... ;)

Dave, I hope to have it ready in a few months.

Oasis, you and me both. :cool:

Wrench, I'm going to keep putting as much time as I can into it. I have a good momentum going and good motivation.

Thanks guys. :D

man, it's been so long since i came to see your car that you might not even remember me. a lot's changed since then! now that the semester's over i might swing by and check out your progress.

Yo villain, 'da fender action is still the crippy-crip. :cool:

That reminds me, I got some updating to do. My car changed colors a couple of weeks ago...:eek:

Dave, I remember you. Stop by sometime, but make plans on the weekend. We're busy these days.

Yeti. :laugh: You're funny.

Lets see an update on that car. :cool:

MIkey,
Your car looks great, you have been busy, great job!!!!

My brakes are here from Lanner. I've just been too busy to post the pics.

I'm not finished but here are some pictures of "The Man"s handy work.

Spindle and bracket
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
All on the car
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...4.jpg~original

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...5.jpg~original
Note my "Turbo" center caps. I also have a "Turbo" embelem for the rear deck lid.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...7.jpg~original

Lanner's quality is great as always. I went together Perfect. I just can't find my dust cap for the passenger side, but that's my fault. It appears that with a little work, the brakes can mount on stock spindles. I havn't asked Lanner yet, but they might need to go on standard spindles to get the right height, the fenders are widened, but I like the height right now. When I add weight the car will lower more. I have to keep my water lines in mind along with my fenders. Although, I can turn from lock to lock with out hitting the inner fender on either side. That was my goal. To keep a stock beam and be able to pull into a parking spot with out a lot of trouble.

those brakes are sweet! you think it'll be ready for next year's funfest?

Very, very nice. :agree: :agree:

I told Davetaylor I'd post some pictures of the fenders, before and after. I've been really busy so I havn't had much time. Yeah, it will be ready for funfest next year. I didn't think to take much before pictures. I just kinda jumped right into it. I was more worried about messing the fenders all up with my amature metal working skills.

Here are the pictures.
The first picture.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...e.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original
This is about the only profile shot of before.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original

and now the most recent pictures...

Here are the after shots, while not completely finished, these are further along than the before and a lot closer than the first few pictures.

Similar to the first picture. The angle is differant though.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...7.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...0.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...9.jpg~original

Are those the pictures you had in mind dave? If the before shots are not clear enough to show the profile changes you might have to find some on thesamba or some place of stock Ghia fenders. I wish I would have taken more of the before, but I was more worried about the fenders than pictures. I think if I remember correctly, the fronts are widened about an inch to an inch and a quarter. The rears are about 2 inches wider I believe. I cut the bottom of the rear and pulled it out as far as I could then welded it back to gain more cover on the rear of the rear tires. I hope that makes sence.

I worked a some thursday night, friday night, and today. I'm planing on working some more tomarrow. I'll take some more pictures and post them when I get the time.

man, it looked pretty sweet in the before pictures, hehe. you don't like the "fresh from the bottom of the river" style? :laugh:

those fenders are a lot different than stockers. being pretty ghia ignorant i didn't notice, which is probably good, because if it's too obvious then maybe they look weird.

i can't wait to see that sucker on the road!

That is a good point, if they were too crazy, they wouldn't appear stock. I also can't wait to see it on the road.

I'm in love with this Ghia. I just need to find the pefect color. :cool:

i had my last bug painted black and if i had the dough i'd have my current project done black too. it's a pain in the butt but it sure looks good when it's clean, all fifteen minutes of it!

i used to have paint books lying around somewhere, but who knows where those are now. just remember that if it's something too trendy it'll look dated once that's fallen out of vogue, so i'd vote for no color-changers.

with that engine no one's going to notice the color anyway!