901 trans. code
 

Hello

I found two 911 transmissions with the number 901.301.301.1R. and the second one with the number 915.301.301.6R on it. I know the 901 trans. is the early one and its weaker comp to the 915. I don't know how to identify wheather its a 5 speed or 4 speed one (as found on some 912 models). What gear ratios does the 901.....1R have? And how can I be sure about the condition of the trans. before actually buying it. The output flanges I measured for the CV's have 110 mm outer diameter and the bolt pattern is appr. 97 mm's (both the 901 and 915). Which VW CV joint should I use? Type 2 or type1? From what I understand the 215 mm type 4 Volkswagen Bus clutch and pressure plate s a bolt on to the 901 trans.
Do I have to reverse the throwout arm (can it be done) on the 901 cluch mechanism in order to mate it to the VW cluch cable? Which throwout bearing (Porsche or VW) is to be used?
I've read the Porsche trans. into Bug article in a VW Speed issue (was the 2004/11 issue I guess) and the installation seems to be quite straightforward with the Bug@5-peed parts.
The asking price for the transmissions is 800 USD each, but as the 901 conv. seems easier then the 915 conv. I'm more inclined towards buying the 901 one. (The 915 needs the original and expensive 911 cluch and press. plate if I remember right?) Thats too many questions asked I know. But since this is the only option to get a 911 5 speed trans. for me, I would be very happy if someone could help me out on this subject.

Greetings.

Hi 1303 C2/3,

could have contacted me directly, no problem with questions.

The described 901 gearbox is one of the latest types, cause it has the pulled clutch system. The number that you gave is not correct. The correct number is underneatht the gearbox (the one you gave is the nose cone´s number).

It depends on which engine you would like to install, what gearbox you take. The 901 has short ratios and stands up to 270/280 Nm (only have the German torque measurements). The ratio of the gears are (from 1st to 5th):
3,091; 1,888; 1,318; 0,961; 0,793.
The 914 gearbox is nearly the same but has much longer ratios (4th and 5th):
0,925; 0,709. With tyres of 225/50/15 it makes a difference of 20 km/h in the fifth gear.
The 901 is ok for engines with high revs, but not for torque strong big engines.

The 915 is really a beast. It has long ratios and stands up to 350 Nm torque. We only take it for turbo-powered engines (f.e. Subaru Turbo).

The axle flanges can be changed to ones with smaller diameter (have them for both gearboxes). Have the conversion parts for 915 also.

The 901 clutch lever can be changed to one for a pushed clutch. The 915 can be changed to pushed clutch also.

If you have more questions, or if you like to order something (-:, please contact me info@bugat5speed.de

Cheers Martin

Hey Martin nice site..

Bablefish became my best friend.. seems like you have some nifty parts..

Can you go into further detail, in another tread? Not sure what the protocol would be.. but curious as to your solution for putting a 901 911 into a bug..

Seems like you address the transverse front mount, shifter, shifter tube and clutch.. but it was a little difficult with the translation..

Do you have an english version of the site ;)

PS Nice parts
Alex

Hi LOAF,

sorry no English site yet. For the 901/914 conversion it´s a nose cone (30 mm shorter than the original one, the front traverse, axle flanges (for beetle cvs and also for Porsche 944/Bus cvs), clutch cable mount plate, clutch cable connector, adjusted clutch lever, 5-speed-shifter.

For the 915-conversion it is a short nose cone (20 mm shorter), axle flanges with Porsche 944/Bus diameter, and a front aluminium cast traverse too.

Am preparing a rear traverse at the moment that fits the bellhousing of the Porsche gearboxes (is different to Beetle bellhousings).

Already made an own thread in the past, but it seems that nobody really wants to drive 5-speed in the US. Here in Europe it´s quite an important technical improvement and there are lots of interested people.

I always say that it is better to drive such a gearbox from a well known sportscar manufacturer, than installing such a hobby solution like some companies offer (making 5-speed out of a Beetle gearbox). The Beetle gearbox always stays a Beetle gearbox and does not stand that, what lots of people wish, that it would do.

If you have further questions please contact me directly, as it always seems to be an advert conversation.

Cheers Martin

Martin,

I will look for that older thread..

Probably the initial reluctance was from the piecing together of all the parts.. One stop solutions that work are probably more receptive.. also cost.. but fear not there are plenty of folks starting to get on the wagon...

I will talk off line.. as I have some more questions, that may not be completely appropriate, with out turning this into a sales pitch..

If you have any pictures of the tranny's in beetles that would be nice..

Alex

Bug@5speed..

PM sent with some questions, that hopefully you can clear up for me..

Thanks
Alex

@LOAF,

sent a PM.

Size of messages is limited to 3500 single units. Please write the next message to my e-mail-address info@bugat5speed.de

Thanks Martin

Evil and all,

Had a length conversion with Martin, at Bug5 to further discuss issues. Based on intial discussions and customer service, I will try some if not all his products and report back. Only factor is $$. I am looking at getting some items in Dec and make that my winter project. The approach seems straight fwd..

Hope the info I received helps you all. So here goes. I will break this up into different smaller topics.
Topic/Issue/Response

Q1. Tranny Location- As mentioned "Usually hangs back" due to the
nose cone.
BUG5: (nose cone gives 30 mm extra) Therefore by using the Bug5 nose, tranny can be moved fwd.

Q2. Clutch and/or frame horns..
BUG5 These parts are for the clutch cable to a) mount it to the gearbox, and b) make an adjustable connection between the inside clutch cable and the clutch lever of the Porsche gearbox. Both parts are made out of stainless steel. The "Kleinteile" have the correct screw thread M7 inside for the clutch cable. You can easily adjust the clutch with it.

Q3. Rear Cross member
Bug5: to make rear mounts in a powdered version. They will have the contours of the 901/914 bellhousing, which is different from the Beetle´s bellhousing.

Q4 Front Cross member- As far as the front, do I still need to weld in some brackets to attach to this member?
BUg5: Front mount is very very solid. Front mount is bolted under the brackets of the IRS-arms. So you only have to drill a 12 mm whole into the bottom of each of the brackets. Then you can bolt on the traverse. With the traverse come 4 cotters to balance the bevel of the bracket on the underside. Nothing has to be welded to the chassis.

Q5 Output shafts to connect to 944..
Bug5 has them for Porsche 944 cvs.

Q6 Shifter and linkage
Bug5- You use the shift rod of your car. Only at the end (direction gearbox) you must weld in a bracket where the hinge of a 911 is fixed in. That bracket can be cut out of an original 911 shift rod (too expensive) or can be taken from the steering rods (tie rod ?) from most other cars. This part is only for clamping in the hinge.

BUG5 Shifter- It works very exactly and very straight forward. The original shifter from porsche has very long shift ways (120 mm per gear), this shifter only takes 55 mm. The springs inside a very strong and they move you in the right position by shifting forward from 1st into 2nd gear. Although the
901 has a very strange shift pattern (1st left side
pulled, 2nd next line pushed) .

I wanted to add that it also works with Factory Location with minimal tweaking need to fit, as opposed to 901 shifter..

Here is a list of most the items you would need. Prices are on the site..

-Nose cone short aluminium cast
-front traverse al. cast
-Axle flanges (Pair of) for Porsche 944 CVs
-Shifter Bug @ 5-Speed
-Clutch cable mounting plate
-clutch cable connector to lever

I also had asked about some references.. And if anyone has these issues please let us know.

There were reports in VWSpeed (11/04, 4 pages), in VWTech (issue 18, 5 or 6 pages), UltraVW (March 2005, 3 or 4 pages). Products are well known and accepted in most European countries. There are about 100 cars on the road with this conversions. In issue 10/2005 of VW Speed Bug5 car with Subaru Turbo and Porsche 915 gearbox is reported about. There you see some pics. In issue 21 of VWTech (France) a customers car can be seen from the underside with Bug5 parts. In January there will be a big report about my 1303 in VWSpeed (see under Projekte!). It´s a very nice German style. In this report you will see all of Bug5 products on the car.

Keep you guys posted.
Alex
NNJ

Loaf thank you for the info. I've also contacted Martin about the conversion parts. I'm getting the back issue from UltraVW (March 2005) to do some research on the installation (Martin noted that this issue shows the install step by step). Also in regards to the rear mount (he only has them for the newer magnesium cased 901/914 tranny) but that is not a big deal. Also he carries 2 types of the front nose cones for early/late trannys. So you will have to figure out whether your 901 is made from Magnesium or Aluminum before you purchase the parts. I will be also purchasing some of his parts to do this conversion (hopefully by December) so that I can complete my T4/901 install. So depending on who gets their parts first I might need to bug you (your free to ask questions if I get my parts first) about the install. :laugh:

:)

Awesome the race is on.. Darn brother is holding my equity that I need.. Never do business with younger brothers.. Had to lend him for the VW fund..

Thanks for pointing that out about the case.. I will be ordering the back issue asap. had forgotten about ..

I think we maybe onto something here. Do you read German?
Sometime things get lost in the translation..
Take care.
A

:D the race is indeed on. I've ordered the back issue last night and I'm having it airmailed to me (hoping to see it soon). I think there is a post on the shoptalkforums about this conversion (I'm going to hunt it down tonight). I'm hoping to purchase the setup by thanksgiving (going to divert funds from my fuel injection buy....I'll live with carbs for now). I'm really believing that we are indeed on to something here. And the fact that its already installed on more than a handfull of cars makes me feel that the old way of installing the 901 is about to go the way of the doudou (bad spelling day). I've got a few questions for Martin but I'm saving them up till after I have all the info so that I only bug him once (besides I might find my answers in the article). You did make a good point about the translation of the website. I don't speak German....but I think I can find someone who does.

LOL..

Man I think you got me.. I am half way there and my younger brother has some $$ he owes me.. Probably get it by mid dec.. darn.. Second place is almost as good, I think..

I hear you..

When you ask martin please CC me.. olaverriam@yahoo.com
I got some home work to do myself.. Mind if I ask what your issues are off line?

Talk to you tomorrow.
Alex

Hi,

found out this morning that the currency of Euro to Dollar has decreased from nearly 1.30 to 1.17 in the last weeks. That means, that prices are about 10 % lower than a few weeks ago. So, if someone ist interested it might be that it is a good time to order. Or stay informed about currencies!

Will have a new charge of conversions again by the end of November. Only one kit left at the moment.

Cheers Martin

Martin, your killing me.. :)

I may have to go to become a donor bank in order to beat Evil on this one..

Alex

Just ordered my Back issue ;)

Now I can't wait..
ALex

LOAF: I'll cc you with my questions/replys to/from Martin. You are more than welcome to ask offline. You can send me an email at eviloval@comcast.net

MARTIN: Man!!!! I'm tempted, but I need to do the research 1st. I have been looking thru the net about your products and managed to find a pic of the front mount for the tranny installed. That is one slick arrangement. I'm gathering my questions at the moment so I don't want to bother you with them until I get the back issue of UltraVW. Tonight I'll figure out whether my tranny is early/late and I'll email you. The kit you have left is it for an early or late tranny?

Evil,

I assume that their is a part number/case number that we can reference to determine if ealry/late 901 tranny.

I have to do some searching to..

I will hit you up via email, as I have a bad habit of filling peoples inboxes with questions..
I am my own SPAM generator..
:(

Alex

Hi boys,

didn´t want to put pressure on you. Everyone who wants will get the conversion parts. Don´t want that it looks as if I want to telly you: "hey it´s my last conversion kit at all". I will have new parts again late in November or early Decmber. So, don´t worry!

I have three nose cones left for old 901 trannys (aluminium cast series), only one for the 901/914. But this week the new nose cones are already casted again, also the traverses.

Axle flanges are sufficient in stock at my supplier (I only have to pick them from him), also the 5-speed shifters. The other parts I do always have in stock, as for me they are so called C-parts (no high value to store and no high turnover).

Have just checked the back issue of UltraVW and found out, that you can well see how the traverse is being mounted to the IRS brackets.

The only thing that could make some problem (but you keep your eyes on it) is the currency, that could increase the price for you.

If you´ve got questions which keep you from sleeping, then please write me an e-mail ----- no problem!!!

By this will have some training on my English.

Cheers Martin

LOL..

I can sleep now peacefully knowing that it is not the end of the world..

Thanks for the peace of mind..

Will work with evil to get one set of questions answered, and then address our finding with the GL team here.
Alex

LOAF,

I've meet with Martin, saw his Bug and was taken on a test run so I could experiance his work and it was great :D, his shifter and tranny are fantastic that he builds.
He is even in the works of building a new shifter that will be a direct drop in for those of us who already have the orig 914 style shift plate installed, I did my 5 speed install over 5 years ago.
I was just about ready to put the Ghia on the road when, the tranny started acting up and wouldn't shift any more so I looked up Martin and we meet.
I should be getting my tranny in about another week or 2.
If you have any question ask away, I understand German preatty well.

70Ghia,

Any fotos of the conversion that you did.. Ovil and Myself, both ordered the back issue.. I have searched the web, but did not seem to find much as far as pics..

Any more input that you could give us is extrememly helpful.

Take care
Alex

Alex,

Did you check out the tech art here on GL, it has almost the same amount of info that Martin's does.
I can take some pics for you later on this weekend.
What exactly are you wanting to know?
I opted for type 1 axle flanges on the tranny as my IRS already type 1, and went with a beefier axles from my friend at Wolfgang Int.
Reason being it was cheaper to just up grade to thicker type 1 axles than hunt down a good used or new pair of type 2 or 944 IRS axle flanges, then you need a set of axles too.


Chris

I got my back issue of Ultra VW today (I'm glad I got a 1yr sub....hot vw's should take some notes). After going thru the article's installation its sure alot easier than the known 901 install. Just some notes.....you will have to remove the front tranny mount from the pan (not a big deal...but a slight bummer), a hole is required for the shift linkage to go thru (same thing you would do the standard way) and you still have to clearance some areas of the frame horns to fit the tranny (a few more than the standard way). The extras are to fit the relocated clutch tube and the cable guide bracket. Some welding is required but not that big of a deal, you will have to move the clutch tube in the pan to clear the tranny (small tack weld).

Also some notes to think of: It would be easier to do this conversion with the body/pan separated from each other for obvious reasons. I won't have this luxury due to space limitations....so it will be interesting to say the least. Also, due to the location of the tranny's front mount you will have to remove the trailing arms from the IRS pivots to install the washers/bolts and spacers (good time to install new bushings since your there).

Evil, how long did it take for you to get your mag..

Mine must be lost in space some where..
VR
Alex

LOAF had mine sent by airmail....only took a few days. I'll add some more info later today about the questions I had.

Evil, you bum ;) beat me by two days.. Just got my mag.. very excited to go thru it and see for myself..

Did not expect it when I got home from work.. felt like a little kid, getting an Xmas gift.. wife already had opened it, since it was in dark sealed bag.. she thought I was upto something ;)

I will let you know what I think once I go thru it..

I need to get my scanner online and post up.. hopefully this weekend..
Alex

Here are some of the questions/answers I asked Martin about his kit. I will be purchasing the kit tomorrow and will be taking pics of the install. Text that is in Italics is the reply:

-The bushings on the front mount....are these replaceable....and if so where/who can I get the bushings from?
They are replaceable, but it is not necessary to replace them. They are very solid and with a steel tube inside. You can get them from me, if they should be worn out (will not happen).

-The 901 I have is an early one. How much work is it to change out the nose cone with the one in your kit?
Will take about an hour of time (incl. cleaning the sealant surface - so, no work at all). Take liquid sealant as Loctite 574 or similiar ones!

-Do you include directions in your kits....or should I use the article from Ultra VW?
Sorry, haven´t got a manual, but installation accordingly to the mag. report is quite easy.

-The modifications required to the shift rod/linkage....do you have detailed info on this or is it a simple mod?
Haven´t got detailled info on that, as there are a lof of different lengths of the shift rod. Have to find out the best length on your car. Use the Porsche coupling, it´s the best one. Take care, that it is not worn out (bushings). Otherwise shift ways get longer.

-I'm assuming that since this is an early 901 the rear transverse that you sell wouldn't work. Would I be able to just drill some hole thru the case and mount it using beetle tranny mounts....or do you have a better suggestion?
Have got aluminium casted blocks, that have the surface of the 901/915-gearbox. They can be bolted to the 901-housing and the VW-rubber blocks can be bolted against them. Disadvantage is, that the gearbox will be about 1 cm higher in your car. Don´t use the rubber blocks from the Beetle, take those from a Bus T2 - they are harder.

A little add on to the question/answer above about the rear mount. Since using the rear mounts would raise the tranny 1cm.....I'm thinking that I would have to clearance the frame horns less to fit the tranny. I will supply info if this is the case once I've installed my kit.

Evil,

Thanks for the update.. I went thru the article somewhat last night, and some of the same questions popped into my head..

Looks like you don't have to bang the hell out of the frame horns, just minor trim.. and with larger rear mount, you may have to clearance less.. (at least that is the perception that I get). Not sure about fitment and clearance of the body with these hardened mounts..

Got some questions on the clutch tube and stuff but I need to get under the car to analyze.. and look at it with the mag in hand..

I ended up buying a shifter 901 from lanner, just before I say martin's site, I may have to put that on the market, I really like his shifter or a variation of it (901) that are sold here in the states.. as opposed to the stock 901..
The shifter linkage and coupler are issues that I need to better understand.. also..

Lastly the nose cone.. anothe plus to this kit, if you have a 914 tail shift is that it looks like you can just buy this cone and flip the diff.. and your most of the way there..

Take good pictures.. I am very interested.. I have to now debate taking the body off.. I think you mentioned something about that.. R U doing it with the body on, or off..

Keep us posted.. and I will go to kinko's and get this scanned as it will be easier than trying to set up the POS old scanner that I have..
Alex

[QUOTE=EvilOval]Here are some of the questions/answers I asked Martin about his kit. I will be purchasing the kit tomorrow and will be taking pics of the install. Text that is in Italics is the reply:

(SNIP)

-I'm assuming that since this is an early 901 the rear transverse that you sell wouldn't work. Would I be able to just drill some hole thru the case and mount it using beetle tranny mounts....or do you have a better suggestion?
Have got aluminium casted blocks, that have the surface of the 901/915-gearbox. They can be bolted to the 901-housing and the VW-rubber blocks can be bolted against them. Disadvantage is, that the gearbox will be about 1 cm higher in your car. Don´t use the rubber blocks from the Beetle, take those from a Bus T2 - they are harder.

Evil - saw this quote and it peaked my interest. I've noted the mis-match between Porsche 901 bellhousing surface and VW tranny mounts. I was first thinking of modifying my new Berg HD mounts - but some pre-formed aluminum pieces that provide a nice surface for the VW mounts to sit sounds like a much better idea! Any way to get pics of this? I'm already eyeing the Suby conversion oil pan, might be adding some more bits to my wish list!

One area I'm having trouble - that is accurately drilling into my Porsche bellhousing for the mounts. Any other options besides buying the SAW type mounts to use for a drill template? Those hole locations need to be pretty accurate.
Jeff

Hallo Martin,

Vielen dank für die prompte Antwort. Momentan bin ich noch dabei die fehlenden Teile und das passende Fahrzeug (schraeglenker Boden) aufzuspüren.
Well I've studied all the related articles on the web, on Herrn Martin's webpage and the VW Speed article. I have quite a picture about what parts need to be bought or done for the conversion to the Porsche 5 speeder. I've bought both the 901 and 915 transmissions. The 901 one will be used with a mildly tuned 2.0L Type 4 engine for which I'm collecting the few missing parts at the moment. The 915 one I'll keep for a future turboed type 4 project (hopefully :D ) as done by Armin Klein www.turboboxer.de.
However there are a few things which I couldn't figure out. İs it a must to use the 914 flywheel for proper starter engagement? Can a automatic vw starter work with the type4 bus flywheel? İ don't think that I can find a 914 flywheel and starter! Do I have to use a custom releasebearing fork with the late 901 trans.? Or is it possible to modify the push type lever arm to pull type and will it work with the wv release bearing?
Thanks for all the nice information. Hopefully very soon I'll e-mail you for my parts orders.

Freundliche Grüsse.

Atay

LOAF: I'm going to try to do this with the body on. I don't really have enough room in my garage to raise the body. As a result I'm going to gut the entire rear end, por15 the bottom of the body and pan, change all the bushings to urethane, replace all the bearings (already have everything....thank you Topline) and finalize my 944t brake conversion. Its going to be a pain in the butt....but, in the end it'll be worth it. I will be taking pics before and after each step of the process so if anyone has questions I might be able to help....or someone can help me if I get stuck. The biggest obstacle will be lighting (I might have a solution for that).....and the other one will be locating the rear mounts on the tranny. In regards to those I'm going to make a jig from my old t1 tranny (before I remove it) so I can locate the 901 in the same location. I already purchased my kit and can't wait to start installing it.

GS GUY: If someone doesn't get you a pic on the mounts....I'll get you one when I get my kit. The only worry I have about the whole install is the rear mounts. I'm going to be installing those absolutely last with the help of a self made jig. I will admit that I'll be measuring quite a few times and mocking everything up before I drill a single hole into the tranny.

Hi 1303C2/3,

it´s the best to work with the 914 flywheel as it fits best to the clutch lever ratio and the clutch bearing. But you can also use a type4 bus-flywheel. Then you must adjust the lever, so that you have the correct ratio for the clutch release. You can use a 914 starter, a Beetle automatic starter (if strong enough for your engine), a Bus T3 automatic starter, or starters like the one from Gene Berg. I do also offer a very strong starter (1.4 Kw). It costs 250 Euro. It has very much torque, as it is with a gear-set inside.
You can not modify the pull type clutch lever to a push type one. Try to get one from a 901 gearbox with push-type. You can use the original clutch bearing of a Porsche 914 and by the way it´s the best solution, although it´s not cheap (but still cheaper than a pulled type from a Porsche 911).

Hi Eviloval,

don´t worry it will also work when the body is not raised from the floorpan. It´s a little more work and it´s not that easy as you see it in the report, but most of my customers are in that situation and it does work.
Will have a check on my bank today. Hope to get out the goods early next week.

Cheers Martin

Martin, and all

Finally made it to Kinko's and have 2.4 Meg PDF file of the scanned article from Ultra..

Can one of the moderators or someone host this as a tech article.. would be helpful to showcase the conversion parts and how to..

Please PM me or email me if your intersted in the article in the mean time..

Thanks
Alex

PS Martin I will email you a copy tomorrow for future reference.

EvilOval:
your goods are on the way since last Friday. Hopefully with you by the end of the week.

LOAF:
Thank you for the PDFs of the report. I will add them to my site as soon as I make the English version.

GS guy:
think there is still an answer open about the dimensions of the sump. I will check it for you the next days and give you an answer.

as a current update for all of you (especially for 70Ghia):

my new shifter for Porsche and for Bugs with already installed Porsche-shifters is coming forward well. I have the first housing back from milling and will be able to mount it the next days. As soon as I have first pictures of it I will have them on my site (see under Projekte).

Will have new nose cones by next week again, traverses and oilsumps before Christmas, rest in stock.

Cheers Martin

Martin, will the shifter include the shifter rod assembly?

Glad the file helped.. I will contact you very soon..
Alex

Hi LOAF,

there is no shift rod with the shifter if you mean that. But the bushing for the shift rod and where it is mounted in is a part of the shifter. So you get it as you see it on my site. In addition you need the connector to the gearbox from Porsche. It costs 40 Euro as a new part. Can give you the product code, if you want to order one from Porsche.

Hope to have answered your qestion. Do sometimes have problems with understanding, although I do understand most things in English

Cheers Martin

Hi EvilOval,

have the goods arrived in the meantime? Haven´t heard anything from you the last weeks. Please give me a feedback. Can do it by mail also.

Cheers martin

Martin....everyone,

The parts arrived (early christmas present for me :D ). I opened everything up and all I got to say is everything looks great....its a shame most of it won't be seen when its installed. Anyways, if anyone needs pics of parts let me know and I'll clip some off. I'm in the process of cleaning and disassembling the car and will hopefully start fitting everything to the tranny next week with the mods to the car happening slowly over the course of the next few weeks.

Evil,

You know I need pics.. olaverriam@yahoo.com

Hey did you get the CD.. let me know..
Loaf

Evil,

Any updates.. still going to tackle this via body on?

Can you post some progress pics..

Martin just got my wire transfer, so hopefully in the next two weeks I should be getting parts to my door..

Depending on the weather in the North East will determine if I venture outdoors..

Excited.. no I need to source some misc items..
:) :)
Loaf

5 speed here we come..