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-   -   Ghia Wiring Thread (https://www.germanlook.net/forums/showthread.php?t=11376)

Mikey November 26th 2011 01:35

Ghia Wiring Thread
 
I bought a 14 circut harness from Kwik Wire. Not a bad kit overall. Even though it's my first harness install.

I have the headlights and front turn signals wired. I'm working on wiring the megasquirt harness along with the rest of the car.

Now I'm having a problem. I've started on the tail lights and the ghia's tail light has 3 bulbs. Stop, Tail, Turn. Except the harness only has a Stop/Tail, Turn. I don't know how to separate the brake and tail. I have an instruction manual, and it mentions nothing about this problem.

Any suggestions?

owdlvr November 26th 2011 04:00

After reading the instruction book, here's what I think is going on: the Kwik Wire harness is setup for slightly more modern 1157 style bulbs. The brown wire (#29) is the common "tail light" wire, it provides the power for the running lights. The Green Wires #48, #56, are for the turn signals flashing lights. BUT, inside the fuse box they must also be relayed to provide the brake lights.

In an 1157 bulb there are two filiments. One is the lower wattage side (running lights) and the other one is the high wattage which is used for both brake lights and turn signals.

...I won't be able to sit down until early in the week, but I could probably make you a relay diagram you could use to make your 3-light ghia setup work.

-Dave

Mikey November 26th 2011 17:25

Man if you could help that would be great. I'm not in any rush. Just confused.
I would really appreciate any help.

Thank you.

owdlvr November 26th 2011 20:44

Hi Mikey,

After thinking about it for a while, there isnt an _easy_ way to use the three separate tailight bulbs without adding a new circuit to the system. If it were my car, here's what i would do: Use the Kwik Wire harness for the taillight and turn signals, but not the brake light switch. The easiest way to do that is to simply not hook up the brake light switch section of the harness. (Ref: page#23 Wire #18 and Wire #17). Otherwise, on page 24 connect the turn signal wires (Green wires) to your turn signal bulbs and the taillamp wires (brown) to the taillamp bulbs. So by now you should have the taillamp wire connected to the running lamp bulb, and the turn signal/brake light wire connected to the turn signal bulb. Once you've skipped the steps i mentioned the Kwik harness should still work for your running lamps, turn signals and hazzards...but not brake lights. (Wouldnt hurt to bench test it first!)

Now we need to make a brake light circuit. Im assuming at this point the ghia has a dual switch system with a warning light, similar to my 69-75 bugs. If you want to maintain the warning lamp system, its possible. But here, for ease of understanding, Im going show you the bare minimum to get brake lights working. For me, i will run my brakes off dual brake light switches, fused in every possible way so that if one switch fails i still have lights, and if a fuse blows I can quickly know what part of the system is a problem. I dont need an idiot light to tell me one of the front or rear brake systems have failed...I'll feel it! So no warning system for me.


The simplest method:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7162/6...0ba6387a_z.jpg

So first up, get a 5-tab standard automotive relay. You'll also need one fuse holder, or one free circuit on your kwik fuse panel. The brake light switch has three terminals. You'll need to connect tab 82a to chassis ground. The switched side of the brake light switch (81) is going to go to the ground terminal on the automotive relay (terminal 85). The switch and power side of the relay (terminal 86 and 30) need to go through a 15amp fuse to positive battery power (always on). The 87 and 87A terminals of your relay are connected to the brake light bulbs. Advatanges: this is the absolute minimum you need to to have functional brake lights. Disadvantages: the system has no redundancy. If the brake light switch fails, or one bulb/wire grounds out you lose all your brake lights.



Best (and a bit over fused) method:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7154/6...9ffd18f3_z.jpg

Go and get two Automotive 5 terminal relays. Get four fuse holders (or four available circuits in your panel).

On brake light switch A, connect terminal 82a to ground. And the termninal 81 to terminal 85 of both relay #1 and relay #2.
On brake light switch B, terminal 82a to ground. And the termninal 81 to terminal 85 of both relay #1 and relay #2.
The 86 terminal of both relay 1 and relay 2 are connected to always-on power through a 5amp fuse. Use one fuse per relay. Connect each terminal 30 on the relay to always-on-power through a 15amp fuse. Use one fuse per relay.

On relay 1, connect terminal 87 to the left side brake light. On relay 2 connect terminal 87 to the right side brake light.

In this case, if one bulb blows a fuse the other side will still work. If one brake light switch fails, the other switch will still keep your brake lights working.

-Dave

Mikey November 26th 2011 23:05

:notworthy: You are The Man! While it took a couple of reads to really understand it. I believe I have a good handle on it. I'm going to buy another 4 fuse block to add to my harness. You are a lifesaver. Also I am using a late model dual circut MC.

Thanks again, I'm sure I'll come up with more questions.

owdlvr November 27th 2011 03:25

haha, sorry for the confusion. I wrote it on my blackberry in between coaching sessions. Definitely could have been easier to read!

-Dave

Mikey November 27th 2011 22:56

Nah it was easy enough to read. I'm a welder by trade, so I'm still learning. This is my first car. Thank you again. I have nearly all the switches figured out. I just have to install them into the car.

Mikey December 4th 2011 23:52

I'm well on my way now. Finaly wired the tail lights today. I also ran all the wires for the engine and mega squirt.

1 problem, where can I find some shielding for the VR sensor?

By my best guess, I need to wire the ignition, wiper motor, turn switch, remote doors, engine sensors, brake light relays...

Sorry no pictures just yet. I just need the shield cover to continue.

owdlvr December 5th 2011 00:57

Good to hear. Definitely post up your thoughts on the harness when you're done. I haven't picked mine up yet...I keep flip-flopping between OE VW, Aftermarket harness or "Harness by Dave" from scratch.

-Dave

Mikey December 5th 2011 22:16

I would say aftermarket, depending on how much you need to add to the system.

The best thing I've found to help me is some good mellow music when I get frustrated. I like Pink Floyd - The Wall. My only problem is I'm wearing out the cds. :D

One small rant, I've found welding and soldering similar. In both cases I never have enough hands and I manage to burn myself.

Teaser pictures...
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...3.jpg~original
+ (welding cable)
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...4.jpg~original
Any guesses? Yes, I am the man! :cool:

owdlvr December 6th 2011 03:30

Quote:

Any guesses? Yes, I am the man!
Battery in the front?

Quote:

I would say aftermarket, depending on how much you need to add to the system.
That's the problem. I just did the math and I'm going to need 7 additional relays and 14 additional fuses, just for the rally bits I'll be adding to the car. So, even with an aftermarket wiring harness I'm essentially building a bunch of my own anyways.

...but all new wiring is so clean and nice.

-Dave

Mikey December 6th 2011 18:47

Well, I thought about relocating the battery to the front, but with the spare tire and the radiator. I literally have no room.

The wires are for my crank sensor.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...5.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...6.jpg~original
Final product.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...8.jpg~original
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...1.jpg~original
Of course all of this is made possible because of my wife's helper. "Flea"
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...7.jpg~original
I basicly made my own shield. The edis ignition controler has a shield wire. So I'm going to connect my shield to that wire and hope it works. I also need to shield the two wires from the MS to the edis controller.

Sorry for the poor pictures, it wouldn't focus and I was tired.

So basicly, if you went aftermarket, you'd almost need to make another harness on top of the one you buy just for all the extras? Sounds like you might need to make your own. Maybe cheaper, and you can get exactly what you want. Although it will be more work for sure.

Mikey December 17th 2011 19:39

I have a problem now. I wired a relay on the luggage shelf along with the MS computer and a 5 fuse block. Fused connections, relay, edis, injectors 1&2, injectors 3&4, Megasquirt computer.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...2.jpg~original

My problem is, I connected the positive to the battery and used a test light on the negitive. When I turn the ignition to run. The relay clicks and the computer comes on, but when I turn the ignition to start. The computer goes off and the relay clicks off. How can I make it hot on both run and start?

Thanks,

ricola December 18th 2011 06:18

Sounds like you have used the accessory output from the ignition switch (which drops out during cranking) rather than the engine power signal (which stays live), easy fix!

Mikey December 18th 2011 22:59

Thanks, I'll check it out.


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