Forget the rotary, they might make some hp but they lack low end grunt. And the reason say a 10 second N/A type-1 engine is a pain to drive is because to make that kind of hp the need a super high lift cam, monster carbs, giant exhaust, and the heads ( Superflow and such). Now the down side of all of those parts, you sacrifice low end with the carbs, exhaust and the cam. The problem with the cam is that it doesn't "come on" until say 3500-4000 rpm. Now with these after market high-po heads they dont have the cooling fins like say a stock 041 head. Type-1 are mainly a peaky and violent engine compared to a type-4. What do you want from an engine? What is going to be it's purpose? And I think turbo-charging a type-1 or type-4 would be your best bet, but if you lack experience do your homework(books and other online material). The great thing about the turbo is to make more power you dont have to increase the size of the engine, up the compression, or anything else like you would with a N/A engine. A turbo is a torque mutiplier. Turbo = More Torque = More Fun.

I just finish a 2275 Type 1 with Dell 45's, 9.8to1 comp., Street eliminator heads 44x37.5, a Web Cam 122/125, 1 3/4 merged exhaust. I used a DTM type 1 shroud that cools the S.E. heads very well and the cam selection was spot on. It has a very type 4 like torque curve.
http://www.sevwa.com/2275graph.bmp

Oh yeah, That suckers nice. Doesn't have the fuel peaks and vallys like I saw on the 2270 type C?

Sorry the graph stopd a 5500 rpm. The MSD rev limiter hit at 5800 and we lost 2 belts and didn't have another belt unless I took the one off the bug I drove 2 hours up there with and I had to get home so we stopped at 5500. I now have a new plug in for the MSD and the Alternator alignment has been solved.I think the HP curve would have nosed over about 6K and around 155 hp. maybe 160, don't realy care because I have seen the torque curve and it is mean for a Type 1.

Like Jake says "Its all in the combo!"

How much did that engine cost you to build? Any theorys as to how long it's suposed to last?

It is built from (slightly) used parts(not the cam/gears, oil pump or lifters, bearings, etc) I did all the machine work and the dynamic bal. job myself at Jakes. I have not added up my cost yet. I'm sure it will not last 1/4 as long as a type 4 built from the proper parts but I will have fun with it as long as I can or I will sell it soon and do a type 4. Mine is truely a swap meet special, but it runs like hell. :agree:

I've recently been thinking to the posibility of a Turbo type 1. I think that would be way fun. And work well.

What makes a good starting point. I was looking at shop talk forums and people are running stock all the way to 2217! I read somewhere that turbos like shorter strokes (or was it longer strokes I don't remember). I'm interested in making power everywhere! So a smaller turbo would be good, that way I could make boost waaaay low. I do NOT want to exceed the 200HP mark in any way shape or forum. I dont want to spend thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars on a Super Tranny for my Super Beetle. Although I do recognise that a perf. tranny is required/recomended.

This is a steet driven car, want gobs of low end torue and to pull like a scaled rabbit to *whatever deemed sane/built for* rpms. .0034% Drag, 20% Road Race/Twisty Canyon road, 80% Street. I'm willing to go and check out the engine every week or two. (Valves, keep an eye on it..) I don't want to worry about taking long trips in it (obviously, I would check it first). Nor do I want to pull it every week.

I've thrown in the towel with type 1 engines, in my hands they don't last. I've now put 30,000 mi on my 914 and haven't had too much trouble (clutch, FI which led to a little head troubles). Overall the engine is stout and very streetable, it works for me and my lead foot.
From all my research turbos like the shorter stroke so they can wind out quicker, VW Trends put a mild turbo on a bone stock 1600 and it ran strong till it blew.

I've come to think that if this car I'm lookin at comes with a type 4 core and webber cabs. Wich is expensive part (I'd imagine) Mabey it's best if I just go with the type 4. As with the type 1 I would have to buy everything. Well I'm sure I can ger from DCNF's for the type 1 but not like those are going to do anything :D

I wonder how big of a type 4 I can build with Webber 44s.

I use 44s for Type 4engines up to 2615ccs with great results. The Type 4 is all about port velocity and not volume on the intake side...

The fuel plots on the 2270 were simply that particular dyno session, I have built 200 2270s since then and 9 of them were devoted only to testing...

The site is being updated as we speak

I'm curious then why you use 42/44mm carbs on the 1316? Must be the rpms..


I'd just love your 2270 or 2316 or if I won the lotery (or saved up for extra year..heh..) your 2563. Do you offer the 2563?

I'm currently looking for a more "economical" way to make nice torque and about 160-200HP. Mabey 1.7L or 2L with the 90MM cylinders running 10 lbs boost. Your DTM or stock (type 1 and 4 tin combined and modified upright) cooling. Does the "vanagon" head offer any exhaust upgrades other then using a "real" seal? Mabey 270dir, .440 lift. Mabey stroke a little.. whatever makes a good 'combo'

Considering I can fab the turbo might be good for awhile.

Actually.. I've got acess to a "ED" core. Some said it was a 2L some said 1.8L 2 liters had a 94 bore, 1.8 had a 93 bore, 1.7 had a 90 bore. Wonder if it matters in a turbo.. not a big difference.

My 2316 turns 8,000 RPM in my 914- with ONLY 40 dellortos!

I do offer the 2563, its a super hero and I only build 4 per year- no more than.

Is there a more 'economical' approch? 180HP rev to 6.5 7 grand.

If type 4 useing Webber 44s.