What do you think, where is the gap between germanlook and racelook? Just because actually all the "ethalon germanlookers" are for track use only..for me it means they are true race cars. What about the daily drivers? I think "the classic" germanlook means a street legal car inspired by the kafer-cup's cars and not a car that is as fast (or even faster) on track as a real race car. It has to be a powerful engine (aircooled or not is a big question), better brakes, suspensions and bigger wheels like the standard ones. As we are talking about a style, they don't have to be real time attack machines, enough if they have the modern/race feeling in my opinion. (I'm not talking about the 20" chrome rims and stuff like this) To own a GL means that you have a bug that is at least as fast and reliable as the nowdays cars on the road but much more impressive and unique.

As bogara said, maybe one of the most acurate definitions for germanlook, or a modern driving car under a bugs shell..

Friendly

Dimitrios

I agree with Bogara as far as the bug has an air cooled powerplant

So, If it has to be aircooled then I suppose that a Porsche 911 would apply? (ignore how difficult it is to fit - that is part of the engineering exercise and I have seen Porsche engined cars in the magazinesthat are definitely Germanlook) Then if that applied what about the watercooled heads that are available on Porsches and then reaching a logical conclusion the current water cooled Porsche boxers could be fitted and they would apply (or not?).
Does it have to be rear engined? or will mid engine do? if that will front engine still apply?
For me as I said, it is little about look or style as those are too superficial, it is about engineering excellence. You only have to look at the main purveyors of German aircooled parts and systems to understand the philosophy. There are few others world wide that are in the same mould.

Clive

I agree with the engineering excellence. It sounds nice to my ears. On the other hand I would never cut any metal from my car in order to fit a 911 engine in order to create "an engineering excellence". 911 engines fit really nice to bays and type 3/25 vans and chias because they have lots of space and you can avoid cutting metal from the structure, but beetles have to stick to the smaller 4 cylinder units. As I stated before my only concern is the powerplant, not the brakes, alloys, interior. The heart of our car is the 4 cylinder air cooled unit.

I think of GL as being more modern, more cutting edge, which Porsche often leads, and of course they've switched to water cooling to keep up. Water cooling fits right into my idea of GL because without it long term reliability with big power is near impossible. My idea of the concept of this site is to showcase cars that can keep up with modern cars, not only in performance numbers, but also longevity.

Jason

'To keep up' with...what exactly?
To keep with your example: Porsche only switched to watercooling because of environmental (read: noise, emission) reasons, not for longlivity reasons. I think they made some extremely potent aircooled engines, proving to us that watercooling is not necessary to keep 'long term reliability'.
I kinda followed porsche's idea's and can report they were right ;) :D

If anyone really feels watercooling is engineering progress (there is certainly a point there), why don't they use the waterboxer as the next step? Subaru, Honda, Alfa engines all seem to be used solely to get a bit more power from OEM engines, so they didn't need to think about designing/tuning that part (the engine) themselves...
Calling it 'engineering progress' afterwards is just wrong therefore imo.

But I love all of you guys as fellow gearheads anyways, so don't sweat it ;)
Walter

It seems to me that this point is debatable , and is a matter of opinion . In my opinion , the GL is about taking a car that is 30+ years old , and bringing it up to more modern standards . Like said before , making the car stop , go , and handle better .

You can guess from my screen name were I fall in the air/water cooled debate. But that is a personal choice.
What defines German Look to me? It is a simple question. If Porsche had built a Beetle (or Bus, or type 3, or Ghia, etc), what would it be? = German Look. If they had offered an RS, RSR or GT version. What would it be? = Bad A$$ German Look.

:D^^^^^^^what he said^^^^^^^:D

I think a built-up air cooled engine is awesome , and I have no problems with using one , but when talking power and reliability , my personal choice would be a scooby engine just because you don't have to do any mods to reach 300HP , and therefore are not comprimising any reliability . Also , being a wayer cooled car , its easier to heat the interior with a heater core . That may not mean much to some of you in the lower 50 , but where I live , warm weather doesn't last too long . As I said before , its a matter of opinion .

If VW have ever decided to evolution an aircooled engine during the past years.............. then it would definatelly be a Subaru boxer:D

Not a chance. If that was the case then why the new beetle has a 4 cylinder in line watercooled engine and not a subaru boxer. Even for marketing sake a subaru boxer would have been more appropriate due to the sound and all but it didnt happen. May be they know something we don't.:cool:

Wrong. They have built it on the Golf IV drivetrain. That's the reason. It's cheaper to adapt Golf drivetrain then building new one that can accept Subaru Boxer.

Subaru and Porsche are working together on boxer engines. Even today. Subarus even have some parts that say "Made in Germany by Porsche".

And I believe that even Dr. Porsche would consider Suby way as a perfect way of Bug evolution.

Even Toyota makes a deal with Subaru for the production of FT-86 which is a a revolution of AE-86 with subaru DOHC engine inside;)