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Suby-conversion advice?
I'm thinking about a Subaru conversion for my Ghia. I think the Power-Cost ratio is worth having a radiator.
What would be some general advice for the converstion? I've started some research already, forums and websites about other conversions. I'm thinking about either a EJ20T or a EJ20TT. I'm also going with a 914/01 Tranny. Would that be a good combination with the suby? Thanks... I'll ask more questions as I come up with them.
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Mike '04 R32 Tornado Red '02 New Beetle TDI - Daily driver '64 Ghia - Project!!-Subaru EJ20T, MS/EDIS, 993 brakes, 914 Tranny... |
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My best advice is do all of the research before you start buying parts. Make sure you know what you're getting yourself in to.
I thought about doing a Subaru swap for a while too. You are in luck though, there are a few guys here that have done/are doing suby swaps. |
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i am also working on an ej swap as we speak. i think that it would be a cool idea to use this thread for ideas, experiences and things we learn.. im all about learning.
what type of info are you looking for? subynotch has a really cool car, and an even cooler site that he logged everything that had to do with his swap. kinda cool if you ask me. also, vwrx, and some others have all also done the swap. |
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What size pipe do I need to run front to back? What size radiator do I need for the size engine? (minimum) What size fuel pump would I need? How much psi would the engine need? Also, I have no clue where to start when it comes to ignition. What parts to buy, where to get them? That's the BIGGEST challenge for me so far. I've seen some go stock, others not... Which is the best/easiest? And, How would a 914/01 tranny work with this engine? Any ideas? Can it hold the power?
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Mike '04 R32 Tornado Red '02 New Beetle TDI - Daily driver '64 Ghia - Project!!-Subaru EJ20T, MS/EDIS, 993 brakes, 914 Tranny... |
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I'll chime in here because I'm doing the research now as well. I was going to do a T4 turbo but a ride in a friends 914-V8 conversion changed my mind
My main concern right now is getting the engine to fit without cutting up any bodywork in the rear too keep it looking stock. I'm using a 914 gearbox which is already installed and the rear of the bellhousing is at the stock 4 speed location. I can't move it any further forward without hacking into the torsion tubes ... and then there is the low sump ... don't want to raise the rear of the bug up. I've heard the 914 gearbox can take about 300 hp/300 tq without killing itself. The pipes / rad / wiring are minor to me ... just have to make it fit first ! Keep the questions coming ! because I'm learning too ! Sandeep |
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I'm also doing an EJ swap, the stock ej20t (tt) longblock/internals will handle 405 hp on average which equals 19 lbs of boost. As long as you can push enough fuel to the motor, it's healthy between 350-400 hp. As long as your tranny will handle the torque of the motor, this is one wicked setup. A 915 will handle about 300 lb. ft of torque.
A stock ej20t header fits, an ej20tt's stock dual exhaust hits the axles, but since the stock exhaust isn't used, you get better heads, better spool up time, because of the sequential turbos, and better torque. Stock EJ20T - 227 hp, power from 3000 rpm. Stock EJ20TT - 276 hp, power from 1700 rpm. I got the ej20tt and i'm gonna convert it to a single turbo, with a holset hx-35 from a 2001 automatic dodge cummins turbo diesel. It spools up at 4000 with the 2.0 ltr, and the turbo handles 40 lbs no problem. My good friend runs this setup on his wrx and it pulls harder than most any car out there. The car has built every thing down to the cryo treated crank, sleeved block, forged pistons and ported heads and everything else you can think of. He puts 30+ lbs of boost on 110 for fun and the car is rediculously fast. 0-60 mph in 3.3 seconds...it doesn't have any problems getting through the 1320. I'll build my motor to handle 600 ponies after the car is built up, so for now, 400 will do...
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1974 type 1 Turbo 6 piston brakes at all corners Project is taking all my money and it's all Germanlook.com's fault! 98' Audi A4 93' T-Bird (oh yeah!) 90' 911 C2 74' beetle |
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I'm building an EJ25 into a '70 bug.
Looks like I'm the only one going non-turbo I have a WRX, so I know what a turbo does, personally it scares the sh!t out of me to put a 227 HP motor in a 30 year old car. I figured I'll start with an EJ25, and boost it later if the hunger for more power comes along In any case, check out my website (in my sig) for details on the build up. I use the stock ECU, mostly because it is a super low budget hackjob that I am doing, guys like VWRX, Jakriz etc are an a completely different league than me A good rule of thumb is to make a budget, and then double it. There is sooo much little stuff that you don't think about, and it will add up the $$$ quickly. I'm not trying to scare you, I actually encourage you, I've had mine running for a little bit and it was fantastic, the torque was addictive ! Rob. |
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its nice to see so many people chiming in on their own setups, it looks like we should be able to share alot of good information. i did have a few little corrections to make before any bad information gets spread around.
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there is nothing published saying the stock ej20 motors will handle 405 hp. infact, i know of a bonestock ej20 motor making 500 whp which is probly more like 600 at the flywheel. thats an ej207. the ej205 is the stock wrx motor, (227hp) and usually can make 400 hp properly tuned. ive seen wrx motors crap out at very low power levels like 350 and up. just depends on the tune, and a good ole thing called luck. further more, there is NOT a direct relation between hp and boost. i have made probly 330-340 hp on one of my cars at 20 psi of boost, and another one of my cars, since it was using a MUCH bigger turbo and a better motor, was probably making about 480-500 hp. boost does not equal hp ever. ever. EVER. there are too many variables to say something like that. Quote:
the stock WRX does not make 227hp at 3000 rpms, it makes it at 6000rpms. do you realize that by saying it makes 227hp at 3000 rpms, you are saying that it also makes 397ft lbs of torque at said RPMs? obviously that is no where near the truth. the stock WRX makes 215 ft lbs of torque at 4000 rpms. also, by saying that the ej20tt makes 276hp at 1700 rpms is also saying that it makes 852 ft lbs of torque at 1700rpms. remember torque and hp are tied in with one another very closely. infact there is a .1 correlation between hp and torque at the same engine speed. remember the formula torque=hp*5252/rpms and conversly hp=torque*rpms/5252 i do understand what you are saying that the tt motor spools faster, because its got 2 seq turbos, but the power figures you stated are way off. Quote:
my car has an HY35 turbo yes, off of an 01 dodge cummins deisel. my motor is built to the hills yes, and it is an ej25 block not a 20 block. it displaces 2.4 liters, and has raised compression, ported heads, ect ect. there is alot happening inside that motor that helps spool my HY35 turbo. it spools at a very reasonable engine speed, about 4k. but again, its not a 2.0 liter car. the hy35 would not go well on a 2.0 liter stock WRX motor without MUCH lag. i do not run 30 psi, the motor and turbo could do it and alot more, but i havent. i have never tuned for more than 20 psi ever on this turbo, and 22 psi on my previous garrett T62-1. it is incredibly fast, and really does do 0-60 in the mid 3 second range, but ive never run 110 gas through it, or tuned for 30#s. lazy, you have some good info, and some bad info, please dont take any corrections as offensive, as they are only intended to help the group. anywyas, here are a few of the latest pics of the motor in my wrx. and im off to go change the plugs right now. the rain stopped. |
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We have the EJ20 non turbo in the UK, it is in the 2l 'sport' models...
Rich
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http://www.ricola.co.uk |
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Mike '04 R32 Tornado Red '02 New Beetle TDI - Daily driver '64 Ghia - Project!!-Subaru EJ20T, MS/EDIS, 993 brakes, 914 Tranny... Last edited by Mikey; October 29th 2005 at 17:12. |
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I've completed my engine swap and have driven it for about 300km now and have never regretted going through the whole proces
here's some pics http://www.cardomain.com/ride/844382/1 currently I'm running the EJ20TT without boost (don't know how exactly to attach the vacuum hoses yet) on a stock type 1 trans and even now it feels very fast. I've done a wheelie once with my previous copper clutch (wasn't very driveable on the streets) but have never really floored it because of fear for transmission failiure. I don't have any real numbers on it for now but my guess is it does 0-100km/h in about 5.5 seconds and I've been over 200 km/h with it but that's just scary |
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hi everyone, has anyone used the rjes bellhousing or similar in a conversion? just curious what experiences people have had...if any?
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1971 Superbeetle, stripping the old stuff, getting ready for paint, then bolting on all my goodies, sorting problems by ones self is a challenge it seems, any GL beetle people in Brisbane say hi! Its been 3yrs since i drove my dub |
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Question...
I'm thinking about an Ej20t or Ej20Tt conversion for my '61 bug, i found some nicely looking and good priced engines in New Jersey(ebay.com) under 1000$... but without ECU. Ofcourse no wiring... what do you guys think would cost me an aftermarket... or original ecu if I can find one, for a 96-98 legacy or impreza engine. I'm thinking about the TT engine, I'm interested, because now I'n in USa, and I want to buy the engine from here, and send it to Romania, my home country, and continue to work there on the car, but I want to buy what I need, when I'm here... knowing about the things I should know. And the other question... what do you guys think about the CSP pro street transmissions? Would one of those work for a 200-220 HP scooby... with normal usage? I've seen around here guys running on bug trannies... maybe not for long Just questions... and about the brakes... if I would use a stock engine, not tuned... new disk brakes... would be enough? not porsche... and other expensive things... because i'm on bugget... and tryibng to get it working... not loosing it in details...
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G'day
For me , personally, I wouldn't touch the twin turbo engines. The Subaru guys down here won't touch them, & the majority that do convert them to a single turbo & make more power, why I don't know. I purchased my engine without an ecu & I purchased an aftermarket one which unleashes lots of power with masses of tuning potential. Plus u get rid of the pesky AFM on the standard engine with an after market ecu which causes a lot of dramas on the standard engine. i only run 8psi boost & have 204hp & 221ft torque at the wheels. More than enough for me. it's now been going for 5 years this Xmas & I have put over 150'000ks (93'000miles) on the conversion. As for the gearbox, I have a single side plate box (1303) in my car, just rebuilt with kombi gears as they have a taller 4th 0.82 & are course teeth 3rd & 4th. I just put 65'000klm (40'300miles) on it before 4th gear let go, but thats because I was stupid enough to go drag racing. I had 2 built so I just put the spare in whilst the other one is rebuilt. That 65'000ks includes daily driving & about 20 track days (supersprints) as well as 3 drag events. I think people underestimate the humble vw gearbox. unless u drive like an idiot all the time a rebuilt vw gearbox will handle the power. hope this helps regards jak Last edited by jakriz; December 28th 2009 at 02:07. Reason: stoopid spelling |
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