GermanLook Forums  

Go Back   GermanLook Forums > General > Project Builds

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #76  
Old August 7th 2020, 21:58
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
Dave,

If you would entertain me, what alignment settings are you running / did you find works best with your setup?

How much ground clearance do you have, and do you have to be especially cautious?

Would you share the stl of your horn button mount?
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old August 8th 2020, 00:51
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
If you don't see me reply with all your answers by Monday, remind me! I'm away from home for the weekend.

-Dave
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old August 8th 2020, 15:31
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
Will do.

Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old August 13th 2020, 03:21
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
Hey Dave,
Just a reminder...
Reply With Quote
  #80  
Old August 14th 2020, 02:09
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
Okay, so I thought I'd be able to figure out where I put the alignment print-out, but it's buried in the box of accounting to be sorted, and I haven't dug it out yet. I can tell you that I'm running 1.5deg of negative camber on both sides, factory toe settings, and zero caster shims, letting the caster settle where it is. My caster is steeper than anyone else seems to run, or suggest...but I prefer the snappier feel on the steering, and don't mind the fact that it doesn't "unwind" as quick automatically. I drive the car, not the other way around.

Rear is factory toe setting, -2deg of camber, possibly -2.5. That's one of the things I wanted to check.

My driving style in a Beetle is to get as much braking done as I can before the corner, in a straight line. I'm initiating the corner, just as I'm rolling off the brakes. Typically I'm fully off the brakes by the time I've "turned-in". I'm rolling onto the throttle before the apex, steering the car with the throttle. I'm not breaking the rear end loose, but the throttle is definitely used to help steer the car through. The Rally Bug has a very narrow warning that things are going to break loose, and when it does (on Tarmac) you better be ready for it to snap. Because the traction coefficient is lower on gravel or snow, it's more predictable on the transition into sliding. Breaking it loose on tarmac becomes a "oh S***!" save-it moment.

The German Looker didn't have enough bite on turn in when I initially set it up. There was a moment of understeer before things would turn-in the way I like, and I found it very unsettling. Figured it was sway bar or spring rate related, until a buddy suggested I lower the front tire pressure. Changed it to 18psi up front and 26psi in the rear on the German Look vs the 20psi up front and 26 in the rear of the Rally Bug I was running...and all is right with the world.

The German Looker is way over tire'd. Between the size and tire choice, it's so sticky I haven't found the limit yet...wet or dry. I haven't pushed it wet super hard, because it's been on open roads and I don't know how bad it will snap, but I can't even get it to give me any warning. I've pushed things hard enough in the dry that something is flexing enough to push the brake pads back in the caliper...but still it won't slide or even deviate from the line I'm pointing it at. It's both awesome, and totally scary, at the same time.

It's low. Really low. 86mm between the spoiler and ground at rest, 90mm between the bottom of the shock tower and the road at rest. I've never scraped the beam or shock towers, but I scuff the front spoiler on every drive that's been spirited. Keep in mind all my roads are mountain roads, and have frost heaves, broken sections, etc. I bob and weave, but I'm not going to slam on the brakes. I consider the front spoiler paint to be a disposable and presume I'll be removing it and repainting it every oil change. I consider the actual spoiler to be somewhat disposable. I'm not going to purposely wreck it, but if I'm having a great drive and it hits the ground...I'm not crying. If the drive makes me smile, I'm okay with it. Speedbumps and driveways, though, make me cry. Mostly because I forget to factor in the 86mm clearance and have done some stupid maneuvers that were totally avoidable. Similar to my lowered '58. I've hit the front apron while leaving a plaza, which just hurts. It's 5kph, you can bloody see it, and it's just total brain fart that causes the damage. For the most part, though, I wouldn't say I need to be "especially cautious" like I see some tuner guys. I take the German Look everywhere, and even took it on (smoother) dirt roads for camping. It's my lowest beetle, but it's not so low that I can't use it.

STL files are here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/85gj6svnnm...ttons.zip?dl=0

...at least until I notice the access to my dropbox is a little high :P Keep in mind that I model everything in Rhino3D, and then convert to STL. It can make some interesting file issues, but they still print fine for me in this particular case. Single and Two button versions in the zip file. I sure hope I put the right versions in!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2020-08-13 at 11.03.19 PM.jpg (81.5 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2020-08-13 at 11.05.33 PM.jpg (80.8 KB, 15 views)
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
  #81  
Old August 14th 2020, 17:43
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
Thanks for all the great information Dave. I live in the Pacific Northwest, and we have similar road surfaces. Lots of twists, turns and elevation changes, coupled with rather uneven pavement in many places.

Your car rides that low?!?! You're running dropped spindles and a lowered beam correct?

HOw level are your front trailing arms to the ground?
Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old August 19th 2020, 02:59
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
Drop spindles and a lowered beam. I wouldn't think twice about taking it on _any_ paved road in the Pacific Northwest...and once Covid ends I'll be taking it on all the roads in in WA/OR for sure. The only one I'd be concerned about is Old Blewitt pass, but that pretty much stands for any classic car.

No idea how level they are, I can't get in to see them on a good angle without a drive-on lift. I'd estimate they aren't quite parallel with the ground, still sloping slightly with leading edge higher than the trailing edge.
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old August 19th 2020, 04:47
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
I look forward to connecting. I live 35 minutes away from Portland, toward the coast!
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old September 21st 2020, 13:20
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
Sept 21st 2020...

I've put over 21,000km on the car so far this season, and tomorrow morning I start my final event for the year. We're exploring the Banff Corridor as part of the Hagerty Touring Series: Banff event. The route is done by Classic Car Adventures, and hosted by CCA & Hagerty.

It's been an interesting 20,000km. There's an all new front beam, the rear suspension locked up on the right-rear corner on one event, and I've somewhat sorted the tire rub issue. More in a couple of weeks once I'm home and recovered!







-Dave
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
  #85  
Old September 21st 2020, 19:23
Wally's Avatar
Wally Wally is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 2,540
Awesome pics Dave! Tnx for posting.
__________________
'75 Super.
...because race car!
Reply With Quote
  #86  
Old September 23rd 2020, 16:33
DORIGTT's Avatar
DORIGTT DORIGTT is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Forest Grove, Oregon
Posts: 687
I can't wait.
Reply With Quote
  #87  
Old November 29th 2020, 02:04
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
Well, I didn't update as promised. Sorry about that! As Covid-19 regulations relaxed a little in the summer, and small group gatherings became an option I started back up with some CCA events. Over the course of a few weeks I managed to put over 15,000km on the German Look beetle, 2,700 on my dad's 1979 Convertible and an unfortunate 1,500km on a buddies truck when one of my event cars failed (more on that later). We toured Vernon to Rossland, to Fernie and Golden on Classic Car Adventures' events the Hagerty Fall Alternate and Hagerty Fall Classic. And then we toured gravel roads from Merritt to Oliver, and Oliver to Kaslo and back to Vernon on CCA's Rush to Gold Bridge event (which, doesn't always go to Gold Bridge.)





In between the Hagerty Fall Alternate, and the Hagerty Fall Classic, I decided to put the new narrowed beam I had into the German Look. I went from rubbing badly on the left front fender, to rubbing lightly on the right front fender. Sigh. I ran out of time to modify the mounting bolts to center it, but will do that over the course of the winter.

The final event for my motoring year was an event I ran in the Banff Corridor for Hagerty. We started in Calgary at Ken King's collection. He owns Concept 1, and has a pretty incredible aircooled collection.




From there it was up through Banff, over to Radium Hot Springs for an overnight. We toured through Lake Louise and back into Banff for night number two. The whole time I was taking people off the beaten path, and onto some of my favourite off-shoot roads that make excellent driving experiences. The long way 'round to Calgary is about 4.5 hours, and includes some of the best driving roads Canada has to offer. Following the event, I went up to Jasper and back...just because I haven't been there in a few years and wanted to stop and see some things...and then made my way home.






To help with the tire rubbing issue on the German Look, I've picked up a new set of wheels which will help the problem, and basically made modification plans that will keep me from flying to Germany to buy wider front fenders. I've clocked 32,400km onto the car since building it, and overall I would say it was pretty bulletproof. I think I have one pushrod tube leaking now, related to a road hazard that got kicked up, but otherwise it's excellent.

On the Hagerty Fall Classic my girlfriend Taylor was co-driving for her first ever event. I knew that somewhere in the route book a double-caution “Dip” was coming up, but couldn’t remember exactly where it was. Taylor was a bit unsure what mileage we were at, when we hit it. Now, a double caution should be taken at a reduced pace. At the time, we happened to be travelling at a very spirited pace…so I now know how the German Look beetle feels in the air. My friend driving a heavily modified Mercedes behind us was floored at how high we went. Interestingly enough, the sway bar link went “beyond center” on landing, and actually locked the right rear suspension fully compressed. I have some minor engineering to work out to fix that, though I am tempted to remove the bar all together to see how the car handles. Once the issue was identified (first reaction was broken torsion bar), it was relatively easy to fix.



Since getting back I’ve managed to knock off about 50% of my winter list for the car. The exhaust stud which disappeared somewhere in Banff was replaced, along with all new exhaust gaskets. I swapped out the tach for a 914 unit, so I can now see the turn signal warning lamps and stop driving like an old-man with my signals on for miles. I’ve reassessed the rear sway bar mounting, transmission mounts, and given the car a nut-and-bolt check. I also made a few other ****pit changes which are either ergonomic in nature, or to eliminate things that were reflecting in the windscreen. Still have some other work to do, including swapping the front wheel studs, now that I've sorted out the front end fit...but it’s coming along.





On the Banff event, someone asked me if I was using the brakes at all on a section of road he followed me on...because my brake lights weren't coming on much, if at all. After a bunch of testing, I've come to the conclusion that my pressure switches work perfectly, but in 'normal' driving I'm often not putting enough pressure into the system to trip the old-school switches. Once we start driving spiritedly, the brake lights seem to work fine. Hmmm, seems I don't really need to do a lot of slowing down if I'm just driving 'normally' :P

We can't have someone rear-ending my car though, so combine one micro switch, a scrap of aluminium, some model airplane hardware, wire, and an hour plus...we now have a brake switch which activates the tail lights as soon as the pedal moves. Factory wiring remains, so I can swap back if this switch fails.





-Dave

p.s. going back to check it posted correctly, and I have to say...I'm really glad I had my professional photographers along for these events! hahaha.
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap

Last edited by owdlvr; November 29th 2020 at 02:12.
Reply With Quote
  #88  
Old December 18th 2020, 01:15
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
I've not been happy with the paint on the German Looker. After finding out from the pros it was 'checked' and needs to be repainted, I never tried getting it polished. My friend Bob finally convinced me we could at least make it way better, and came over to teach me how to do it. Another friend Laurence talked me through the shopping list while I was standing in Canadian Tire, so when Bob arrived I was ready with a new polisher, foam pads, and various compounds and waxes.









While it will never be show-quality, after compound, polish, IPA bath, and wax...it's looking much better and I'm definitely stoked. Totally understand why the experts charge what they do though, my hands are gonna hurt all week!











-Dave
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old February 7th 2021, 02:38
Clatter Clatter is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 115
Love this thread.
Had to read it all again..

Any chance you could get a pic of how you did your removable rear apron?
Is it just held in place by the smash of the fender beading/boots?

Those microswitches are pretty much mandatory with big brakes,
But i had one putting -just- enough pressure it was pre-loading the pedal and covered the inlet port on the master.
FYI.

Do the Weber windows keep the muck out?
Always see those with a bunch of bolts and even a seal sometimes..

Love it!
Reply With Quote
  #90  
Old February 7th 2021, 05:08
owdlvr's Avatar
owdlvr owdlvr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Canada - West Coast
Posts: 793
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clatter View Post
Love this thread.
Had to read it all again..

Any chance you could get a pic of how you did your removable rear apron?
Is it just held in place by the smash of the fender beading/boots?
You'll have to wait until I have the car back in the shop. My Ford Falcon, Bricklin and Subaru are taking up the workspace and I don't have a good spot to quickly pop it off. But basically I just drilled out all the spot welds, leaving both the apron and sides of body with a bit of swiss cheese. Painted the damaged paint, and use the pinch of the fenders and beading hold it in.

Quote:
Those microswitches are pretty much mandatory with big brakes,
But i had one putting -just- enough pressure it was pre-loading the pedal and covered the inlet port on the master.
FYI.
I was pretty careful how I set mine up, shouldn't be a problem...but thanks for the warning!

Quote:
Do the Weber windows keep the muck out?
Always see those with a bunch of bolts and even a seal sometimes..

Love it!
The Rally Bug panels have seals, foam tape around the edges. Even on a wet muddy road I get a little bit of water ingress, but not much. I would consider it to "seal pretty well". On this bug I haven't added any seals yet, and while I don't drive it on muddy roads it seems to keep out the road wet and grime on a rainy day pretty well. Enough that adding foam tape to the edges isn't a priority at all.

Cheers! Thanks for the kind words.
__________________
'71 Type 1 - Rally Project
'58 Type 1 - I bought an early!?!
'73 Type 1 - Proper Germanlook project
'68 Type 1 - Interm German 'look' project
'75 Type 1 - Family Heirloom
'93 Chevy 3500 pickup - Cummins Swap
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:37.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
© www.GermanLook.net 2002-2017. All Rights Reserved