DS Pump

[Sandeep]

Bryan, Pete,

Where did you guys get your "cummings" pumps .. I'm looking for some information on where to get one, does any one have a spare for sale ? I have a tank, just need the pump.

CSP lost my order and its going to be another month before I can get something

Thanks,

Sandeep

[petevw]

Hey Sandeep,

I got mine from Steve. I think they used these pumps in Formula VEE. Hope that helps.
I'm sure Bryan knows more.

Could you source it from CSP Europe? When i ordered my linkage, breather tank, it bought it online through the German site. At that time i didn't know about CSP USA. It came pretty quick.

It my T1 fits your motor, you could borrow it for a month or so.

[Sandeep]

Pete,

Thanks for the info .. I've got a pump ordered now. Do you need a shut off valve between the tank and the pump ? I would think so if the tank is mounted high.

I think thats the valve you were opening when we went for a ride in you Super ?

Thanks

Sandeep

[petevw]

I have a ball valve in between the tank and pump. The tank is so high that if i leave it for a few days the motor "fills up". I've made it a habit to close it whenever i park, and open when i get back in. Not needed, but this way i'll never forget.

[CLKWRK]

Hi Sandeep,

Both petes and my cummings pumps were bought from Ed schumer, petes pump is probably in good shape, lifter chunks went through mine, so mine is junk now.
I was told by crazy eddy that they are old formula vee pumps, they are nice cause they sit low and allow you to run a large fan pulley.
since messing up my cummings pump, i have tried the cb dry sump pump, which i still have and would sell, but i feel that its gears are too small for my turbo application. I have a deano pump now, which has nice sized gears, but will be a tight fit with all my fancy pipes and stuff back there.
I also have a ball valve on the feed, its a bit of a pain to remember to open it all the time, bad news if you forget. I'm thinking of putting a starter interlock on it to not allow the engine to turn over unless it is open.

hope this helps , bry

[Wally]

Hi Sandeep,
Didn't remember your email adress, so I'll post it here:
BAS dry sump pump is appr. 435 euro's. It has 30mm and 36mm gears according to the catalog and oval hand shaped ports to minimize pressure loss and should be a quality item.

Regards,
Walter

[petevw]

Originally Posted by CLKWRK

I also have a ball valve on the feed, its a bit of a pain to remember to open it all the time, bad news if you forget.

over the past 3yrs i've done it 5-6 times.
worst time was: parked under a carport for the night, and since it was outside, i put plastic bags over and around the velocity stacks. well the next morning in a hurry, jumped in the car, and fired it up. was still sleepy and thought, "wierd holding 2500rpm idle and oil light still on!!" finally woke up and shut it down (5sec). took the bags off that where sucked onto the butterfly's, and cracked the oil valve. fired up instantly with oil@100+psi cold, idleing 900rpm, no problem .

other times jump in, fire it up, oil light stays on, shut it off, open valve, no problem. i catch it right away.

usually, the oil light goes out as soon as it turns over, before firing.

[rip]

sorry to drag this topic back up but now that im looking for another oil pump was wondering if you guys can tell me how the CB DS pump is holding up.

thanks
rip

[Wally]

Sorry for the diversion, but I finally decided to get on of these:



36/30mm gears and with internal bearings!
I knew there were options...

[Sandeep]

CB DS pump was working fine when I was N/A, but now that I have the turbo, the oil pressure is a little low when hot idling (about 10 psi according to VDO gauge), but the oil warning light comes on sometimes, not all the time at hot idle. Castrol 20W50 oil.

I'm thinking this happens because the pump is feeding the turbo as well :shrug

I must say that there are no oil starvation problems with this pump at speed ... oil pressure varies between 30 psi and 50 psi depending on RPM.

Wally,

Can you give me some information on the availability of that pump ? What does TP stand for and is it a T1 or T4 pump ? Modifications to fit the T4 case ? Price

Thanks

Sandeep

[Wally]

Hi Sandeep,

Its a dedicated type 4 pump, so don't need any modification; I believe he even asked me what cam I ran because of clearance his designed my pump with
These are the same ones that were used in the old 'Käfer-Cup' W4 cars .
TP stands for Thorsten Pieper, the builder of those.
Here's his 'profil' on the bug-talk forum:
http://www.bug-talk.de/forum/profile...wprofile&u=159
This way you can send him a PM or email. His english is fine AFAIK.
Price is about half of the similar Remmele DS pump, but probably about
4 times the CB pump

Hope I have given you enough info
Walter

[verbeekb]

Guys,

Thought I would add to this topic. I am currently overseeing the build of a 100x71 type 4, 964 P&Cs, programmable EFI, DIS, Jenveys, Porsche 964/BAS cooling system and exhaust, mildly modified heads. The owner has a dry sump pump to go with it and this would be my first dry sump so I am doing my home work.

First off, we can't easily alter the shape of the original oil sump similar to the in-line and V engine guys with bolt-on sumppans do. That means the little oil that will be in the sump will be way below any moving parts. Porsche published a tech bulletin for the connecting rods, they should be notched for additional cooling/lubrication of pistons and wrist pin. I can see how this becomes even more problematic in a dry sump set-up.

In-line and V engines mostly have one or more OHCs, or at least a cam that is above the crankshaft. This will establish more oilflow in a dry sumped in-line or V engine than in our boxer engines. This still creates enough splash lubrication, even enough for the in-line and V engine guys to be wanting to reduce windage even more. Some go as far as to alter the oil return paths so less oil will find its way to the crank. Our boxers have relatively little oil travelling to the heads and most of it will flow back into the sump without ever touching the crank. The need for additional camlobe lubrication has come up here and there, so -expecially- because we cannot change the dimensions of the crankcase easily so its walls keep oil closer to the moving parts like it would in a 911 case. Additional oilers/jets for piston cooling/wrist pin lubrication are not easily fitted in a type 4. I only ever saw one case that had this done and it had an incredible amount of welding done to it.

This engine does not have a mechanical fuel pump or distributor drive, but those could be possible problems for others who are dry sumping with those parts in place.

I know a type 1 with additional sump will run considerably hotter (no exact data) when ran with an oil level upto about the original oil pick up vs. stock configuration.

We have the Schadek pump. I enlarged the exhaust ports of the pressure side to 11mm. This pump still does not make me very happy. I am leaning towards recommending a 2-stage Autocraft pump but any info/experiences with quality DS pumps is welcome. I am also leaning towards wet sump in this case. This is a non track driven Bus.

Any thoughts or data on this would be greatly appreciated.

Brian

www.karrera.net