Wishbone suspension bolt on kit

[Moog]

Ken,

I agree that the rendered design above is probably not ideal. From my very limited suspension experience ("I had a friend who..." etc...) the wishbones need to be unequal length, and inclined at different angles to get the roll centre in the right place, and get changes in camber as the suspension is loaded, etc. The setup above looks to be equal length and parallel, so there will be no camber change on the wheel as it loads up, i.e just like the standard torsion beam setup.

I have no idea how well my system will work, but it is unequal length wishbones and different inclination angles for the upper & lower wishbones. Whether the rate of change of camber, position of the roll centres is right for a stock-ish weight Bug is anyones guess...

Moog

[Alex]

Keep it coming guys....
every input is welcome.
We have decided to build the first one. So every input that you can make could be integrated.
BTW...

Mark and I already discussed some changes.
Alex

[dobergoose]

What are you guys gonna use for uprights?

[Alex]

You have to explain the term "uprights" to me.

English is my second language.

Alex

[dobergoose]

By Uprights I mean the part that ties the wishbones together at the end and mounts the brake etc on

[Alex]

We are going to use the stock disk spindle...if that is what you mean.

Alex

[dobergoose]

yeh thats what I ment

Have you looked into using the uprights from a porsche 928 that way you can bolt on big brakes at the same time

[Alex]

I already have modified stock spindles for my 993 TT calipers.
If this will get sold as a bolt on kit I think it would be good to use as many stock parts as possible because not everybody will use big Porsche brakes. This way you are able to use CB or Kerscher brakes as well.
At the moment we are still trying to figure out the final design.
My problem is that my caliper brakets are pretty big which will limit the wishbone design.

I will post a new rendering as soon as I get it.

Alex

[volkdent]

I had the same concerns as kdanie regarding the design that Mark at Precision Products has worked up. I shared these views with him, but I don't think that is the direction that he wants to go. Simon at Red9 design has also worked up a design that is more along the lines I was thinking. Check out the Shop Talk Forums German Look section under I think Double Wishbone suspension and he has posted a 2d view of his idea there.

Jason

[volkdent]

To Amend:

The design I'm trying to pull off involves not having to split the body and pan or scratch any paint, so Alex, there isn't really any time constraint here!

[Alex]

Jason,

Your frame design has to be a two piece then that needs to be bolted together. There is not very much room in the wheel well cut out and between the frame head and body. The other thing is that the wishbones are to far back....too close to the frame head which could lead into the wishbone touching the lower tray under the frame head that extends out at the edge. I am not too sure were the spindle sits in height.....I have to check on my pan.
The best design I have seen so far is the one that Martin "dobergoose" has on his pan although the frame head is gone. I talked to Mark and he will make some changes on his design. If you have no frame work in front of the frame head you can not bolt on the body to the front unless you make some brackets for it.
There are a couple of pics in the Suspension gallery of Martin's setup and a wishbone that Remmele made for his blue racer.
If you want post your design as an attachment.

Alex

[volkdent]

I've been digging around under the car again! Alex, you're correct, it will be at least 2 pieces, maybe 3 for the actual frame the A arms are connected to.

Another point, this set-up will be for maximum handling, so, though for most it will already be the case, this will be for lowered vehicles only. As you've already noticed, unless the splindle is situated higher, the lower arm will be hitting the tray.

To keep VW, the steering rack will probably be Rabbit or Golf, with or without power.

If you want to keep your height stock or higher, then I thing Payne Precision's front end will be the way to go. But I think that design downplays the handling potential of the A arm set up.

Jason

[ricola]

Just to show I'm still thinking about it. Here's a pic of my sketching so far. I might be able to keep the stock steering with a modified drop link to keep things simple. I haven't thought much about the frame, the main problem is to clear the tie rods and that's hard to visualise before the wishbone positions are set.

One thing that is becoming clear is that it will be optimum for a particular ride height. What height are most people running here?

Rich

[kiwivw]

Spent sometime this weekend looking through some hot rod mags. As you do

Rich, i think you're on the right track, nearly all of the aftermarket stuff shows un-equal length arms, with the lower arm holding the shock and the chassis connector holder the upper shock mount.

Cheers
Craig

[volkdent]

Rich,

You've noticed that the system has to be height range dependant. I think your idea is great for a stock height application and would be a little more straightforward. What do you have in mind for steering?

Jason