fitting a 96-plate

[zen]

need some help on fitting my 96-plate. with some help from no_h20, we built some mounting brackets for my 96-plate mesa and fan. seems like i have the room to fit it except for trying to clear the clutch arm. if i move the cooler to the front to clear the throw, it moves into the curve of the package tray making a solid mount a bit of a challenge.

i have a couple of ideas of how to modify the brackets, but due to time restrictions (don't have time for much fabrication) i wanted to throw it out to you guys to see what you have done. pics would be helpful if you have them. i am considering just dropping to a smaller cooler. i only have the 96 because it was a decent deal.

thoughts?

[Sandeep]

Zen,

I think you know what my setup is .. 96 plate with fan and thermostat, and ducting inside the vehicle. If I were to place a rear seat, it would completely hide the installation.

I noticed that without the ducting, I could get the oil temp up to 220 no problem, and the fan would whirr away trying to cool it, but it took a while, after the car was stopped and turned off.

As soon as I added the ducting, the oil still gets to 180 deg sort of quickly, but the fan turns on some of the time, not all the time. This tells me that the ducts are doing their work.

So what I'm saying is that I think the 96 plate needs some help in the airflow dept ontop of the fan to keep the oil cool .. unless 220 deg is fine.

I'm sure you're going to be pushing your 2316 way harder than I push my 1971.

Sandeep

[zen]

yea, thought of yours, but as this is a weekend warrior more than track car, i don't want the fan in the car with me.

i have taken a look at the Setrab (8.25"x6"x6") and it seems like it would be a great fit on the driver's side of the tranny. cooling is still a challenge there, but can be done. especially as that unit will sit a little lower to the airstream. just a thought since these things are $225.

the 96-plate just looks to be waaaayyyy to much of a challenge to fit under the package tray right. at least on my time schedule.

[factman]

the setrab coolers work way better than the mesa's do and they are much smaller plus they can be a pull through or blow through so the fan can be on the bottom if it has to with the setrab. i have one myself.

[Shad Laws]

Hello-

Instead of looking at the car body for mounting points, look at the transmission. There are a TON of good mounting locations on the tranny... usually about 4 brackets made of flimsy ~1/8" galvanized steel (the pre-drilled kind is my favorite) work wonderfully, and are a breeze to fabricate.

Most likely, it will fit best on the left-hand side FORWARD of the axle, in a vertical position. This is also excellent for airflow.

Of course, don't bolt it to the car AND tranny... that's not good :-).

Take care,

[Ron Roberts]

If you mount it vertically, is there much use for a fan? I find oil temps never really get that high unless cruising, at which time the airflow is plenty. Around town usually doen't raise the oil temps much.

Ron

[Shad Laws]

Hello-

If you mount it vertically, is there much use for a fan?

Yes. Vertically helps a lot for airflow, but so does the fan. In my own *informal* testing, it was ~15ºF more (the temp went up by about that much when my fan died once :-) ).


I find oil temps never really get that high unless cruising, at which time the airflow is plenty. Around town usually doen't raise the oil temps much.

Sustained rpm and, to a lesser extent, sustained load will kick the temps up. Cruising at 80-85mph wasn't in the original VW plan :-).

Take care,

[Massive Type IV]

Sandeep is seeing the negative effects of that "Nice looking" 911 shroud...........I saw that on the dyno, too.

My 2316 is oil cooled by a 48 Plate Mesa cooler and the oil never touches 220 with the stock 914 cooling system, and the external 48 plate oil cooler.
I'll answer Zens question where ghe posted on my forum.

[Sandeep]

Jake,

Get off your butt and finish your 911 setup then When your shroud is done, I'll be ready for my new motor. It will still be 911 cooled but I'm hoping your shroud will be the best one out there.

Sandeep

[Massive Type IV]

Its looking like I won't be doing the 911 shroud at all....The changes it needs are so extensive that I simply don't want to mess with it. After all the mods and costs I doubt that I could ever sell one.

It seems so simple, but is so damn complicated!

[MattKab]

Hello !

That's a real shame Jake.

Maybe the 911 fan needs to meet the T4 engine with a twist on old ideas?

Why not use the 911 fan and custom fan housing/ ductwork/ tinware and flaps, possibly even controlled by a T1 thermostat to blow the oilcooler and/or waste? A cold engine needs no cooling and warming engine needs less than a hot engine.

Needless to say it would have aesthetic issues, but if there is plenty air, why not harness it better?

Is that so mad?

IMO T1 aircooling is the most complicated area of the VW Beetle. The common (or garden) 911 cooled T4 is as simple as the rest of the car. Form and function again.

As a graduate Engineer, I understand nothing but 'Control and Response' is EVERYTHING!!!

Matt

[zen]

with help from NO_H2O we crammed it in. just had to take a different approach on the mounting to do it on an angle. pics coming later today.