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  #16  
Old December 2nd 2013, 07:44
effvee effvee is offline
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Well, everything moving needs oil, this includes the valve guides. At the time I had CBs rhino rockers and elephant feet adjusters..

I think the point is being missed here, my point is; I would like to know how to make/install a low psi oil spray bar.

Honestly speaking, a larger pump and system does not hurt anything, except your wallet. My intake valves now have seals.I thank you all for your responses.
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  #17  
Old December 3rd 2013, 07:49
70Turbobug 70Turbobug is offline
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[QUOTE]I think the point is being missed here, my point is; I would like to know how to make/install a low psi oil spray bar./QUOTE]

You could have a T off of your oil pressure switch with a brake line going to the valve covers that have 2 T-fittings each. Drill 2 holes and cut M6 threads and use M6 wire welding tips as jets. You will have to make adapters out of round bar between the T and welding tip.
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  #18  
Old December 3rd 2013, 08:50
Oval Oval is offline
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take off the seals and your valves will get the oil they need to survive... IF that was the problem
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..and a good ol' Aussie V8
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  #19  
Old December 3rd 2013, 09:58
flat flat is offline
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Keep it simple..the pushrods are your oil delivery to the heads. Just mod that system if you feel you need more oil....external oil lines to the heads etc sounds like the beginning of a story of the car being broken down at the side of the road (increasing failure points) lol

Try Mr Hoovers suggestions:

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...to-it.html?m=1

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...-mods.html?m=1


And ditch the valve seals. If your guides aren't knackered you dont need them in NA situation...not sure if you are on boost, in that case:

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...seals.html?m=1

Lanner
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  #20  
Old December 3rd 2013, 22:05
effvee effvee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oval View Post
take off the seals and your valves will get the oil they need to survive... IF that was the problem
Hi, that's not what I ment. I mean to say,I have valve stem seals so using an added oil supplier, such as a spray bar won't cause a smoking issue.

I do prefer oil seals,I do not discount the possibility of faulty parts. But then that opens another door for me. I have two sets of CB's 044 heads. The head the had this issue were the CB's 044 super mag plus heads. My 2110 engine that's supposed to become a blow through turbo will have the second set of 044 heads.

Jorge at EMW, did a good repair, that head should have been trash.
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  #21  
Old December 3rd 2013, 23:11
effvee effvee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flat View Post
Keep it simple..the pushrods are your oil delivery to the heads. Just mod that system if you feel you need more oil....external oil lines to the heads etc sounds like the beginning of a story of the car being broken down at the side of the road (increasing failure points) lol

Try Mr Hoovers suggestions:

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...to-it.html?m=1

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...-mods.html?m=1


And ditch the valve seals. If your guides aren't knackered you dont need them in NA situation...not sure if you are on boost, in that case:

http://bobhooversblog.blogspot.ca/20...seals.html?m=1

Lanner
Lanner hi, thanks for the info.
1. No matter what oil pump I choose, the circuit.
2. It must get filtered
3. It MUST REGULATE, this is something that all agree on;"the unpredictable pressure relief valves is due to dissimilar expansion rate of metals". Magnesium and steel expands differently. Then, there is the very small amount of oil in the sump 3.5 quarts. 24psi@2500 rpm is stupid.
Once operating temp is reached, it supposed to be guaranteed 17psi @idle. My two cents say it's a crap shoot if everything gets its needed amount of lubricant. The guides only get lubbed by flickering oil droplets from the rockers, that's fine for stock.
Do 70mph for about 30 minutes and then get caught in bumper to bumper traffic, and watch the low oil light come on and temp rise. I've been there did that.

Jay-cee enterprise has a bi-pass fitting, along with the needed circuit plugs bi-pass the stock regulator circuit, look on his site. His filter base has a regulator built in. I am not going to use the stock oil cooler either, grommets won't hold the pressure; so yes to a remote cooler.
I truly believe the stock stuff need to be kept in the stock arena.

Sorry, the whole lubrication circuit needs overhauling, enough of the bandages. We are going hypo on this whole engine, and believing the oil circuit is ok as is nah
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  #22  
Old December 4th 2013, 00:28
flat flat is offline
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To each their own opinion. I'll just say that I respect the engineering that went into the design on the vw engine and wholesale changes are not required to make it work, regardless of stock or hypo. If the parts are all in good shape then they work. If they are knackered then you'll be going around in circles bandaging and "upgrading".

I've done road trips with a t1 motor in my last split bus 500+ miles(one way) at gps 70mph with no issues, with just stops for fuel. No overheating, no oil flickering etc. Stock doghouse oil system with ext filter.

Not trying to deviate you from your plan, this is just my experience. I don't believe in modifying modern valve stem seals on a t1 engine. Just the stock square rings that ride on the valve. They do the trick by NOT being fixed to the guide.

Lanner
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  #23  
Old December 4th 2013, 20:38
Oval Oval is offline
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I hope this demonstrates that standard rocker gear and a fundamentally standard oil system can support high performance:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=553759521342786

This was achieved with no external filter, no external cooler (therefore no leak-prone external oil lines), no fancy fan, no funny business, standard rocker gear and pushrods (of course set-up to suit).

CNC-ported 044 heads, 1916cc, Webers, counterweighted VW crank with prepped standard rods.
Engine carries a power pulley and a small (500mL) deep sump.

And it was 40+ (105F) degrees!

Keep it simple, build it right, and it will survive
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..and a good ol' Aussie V8

Last edited by Oval; December 4th 2013 at 22:02.
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  #24  
Old April 12th 2014, 01:15
dd-ardvark dd-ardvark is offline
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Wow Effvee, reading from the beginning to this point, one thing thing became very apparent. You never got your original question answered. “Is there anyone that sells a (spray bar) kit for adding a oiling system for the rocker arms and valve stems.”
I've been searching for this very thing since 2011 and as of yet …, No.

That said, performance V8 motors often use these, but the lowly flat4 gets none.
As with the progression of time and horsepower this well come to pass that it will be common place, even on our cars somewhere in the future.

Now that I got that out of my system..., you could use a single stage dry sump pump and plumb the pumps pressure side just as stock and the first stage / suction side that would return sucked up oil to your reservoir tank could then be plumbed as a dedicated oil sprayer. How you go about building this is up to you. But I'd copy the V8 boyz and run an aluminum line inside the valve cover and drill one or two 0.030” holes above each keeper face and spring area. Additionally you could cut this gear set and housing down to 15mm, remember your not feeding pressure to the bearings, just spraying oil. Or the easy way and cut a groove in the cover to be self relieving of to much pressure.

Now Effvee, I build widgets from time to time and I've found it best to close my garage door and just build it no matter what the nay sayers say. So whether theirs a need on someones else's car is not the point..., you want one for your ride, that is the point.

You work out the details and build a kit..., people will buy it. That includes me!

Enjoy the day, dd-ardvark / David
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